A transcript of the MP3 file phone conversation between "Spam Slayer" Darren and Alex Polyakov a/k/a Alex Blood.
Jan 17th, 2006
Audio Start: 00:00
Alex Polyakov [P]: (unintelligible)
SpamSlayer [SS]: ... I'm sorry?
P: (unintelligible) you are killing my business. Here I am asking you nicely to please stop with (unintelligible)
SS: Please stop with what?
P: (unintelligible) but you are ruining... *killing* my business. Darren! What do I do? I need you to stop with the (unintelligible).
P: How much do I have to pay you? (unintelligible, background [different voice])... Darren!
P: Did I wake you up? Huh? Are you a little confused? Are you going to stop with the refi thing?
SS: The code's been released --
SS: The code has been released to the public, I'm not the only one running it. *sigh*
P: It is you that's running it, Darren, you made it, Darren, you built the thing. YOU can stop it. You're the only one who can stop it you're *killing my business!* HOwwww much money do I have to pay you? You're killing my business!
SS: I'm sorry I can't --
P: Is this about it you want me to send you money, will this clean up the -- I'm sorry. [I think this is what he said. -- ad.] This is *killing* me now already.
SS: Well then you're gonna have to find a new business.
P: Surely you can work something out, Darren. Surely we can work something out together that will make it work together for both of us.
SS: Alright, here's what people want... They want to be removed. If they request it --
P: But you, Darren, you are adding their email address to the list. If you want to give me your email addresses I would have every single one removed immediately.
SS: That's not true --
P: You can't do it without the remove!
SS: That's not true and I know that for a fact because I asked you several times to be removed and you spammed me even harder, so don't bullshit me.
P: [pause] It's immmmpossible. If you are filling out this remove link, we are cleaning out the list eeeevery single week -- ah -- You think I would send somebody an email that doesn't want to receive it? If there's *ANY WAY* you could send us the email addresses that don't want to receive email us [sic], I will remooove them all immmmeeeediately, I guarantee you a million times. This is the one thing, you think I want to send emails to people that don't want to receive them?! This is the last thing on my mind.
P: But I get the impression from you guys that you are putting all of them innn-to, into the email list, so that -- how can I try to find them? And all I'm trying to do is make an honest dollar like everybody else. (Unintelligible) You are hiding yourself from that email address! [A guess, his audio quality is horrible.]
SS: But it's not an honest dollar...
P: My people are cleaning their lists... Evvvvery single week. Theyyyy are very diligent. Very diligent.
SS: But it's not an honest dollar, it's theft. You're spamming the hell out of every server out there. You're costing a lot of people a lot of money and bandwidth. Do you realise how many billions of dollars you cost businesses worldwide in lost productivity and extra bandwidth and extra, uh, hardware...?
P: No Darren we don't want to get into it, if you want to get into a... a discussion of the... philosophy of the... of the.. of the, uh, of the business. Believe me there are many many many more companies, making billions of dollars OFF this bandwidth. And it's this bandwidth that they wouldn't want to stop it, if they wanted to stop it they would have stopped it. There are as many companies making money off of it as other companies -- WHO do you think -- People pay for this bandwidth, yes? Do you think that I'm getting this money? No! They're rich, corporate, mega... uh, ISP's... they get the... they get the money! They -- I don't get the money from... from [stammers] from the internet. It's all the rich corporations... uhhh... the... the large ISP's, they make the money from the bandwidth. You don't make it, I don't make it. They're the ones who should be paying for it, not me. (unintelligible) My internet is not the same (unintelligible) as emails who don't want receive email. [sic] The internet is only to make honest dollars. I think you have me confused with other people, maybe. You get sometimes confused in your postings between me and betwen this guy and this guy... I don't know. But I do know that... MY internet is only honest dollars and this refi retaliator it is *killing my business!* Darren, it's *killing* me!
SS: Well you're going to have to go to double-opt-in, then. [noise]
P: Listen... if we're going to talk about democracy of email (unintelligible) it's the part of you're allowed to send email even if they didn't opt in as long as the email is (unintelligible) lies... But we are serious about our people not putting in... lies... you.. you... I feel Darren that you are accuse us of... of...
SS: If you're very serious about it then how the hell did you spam the hell out of me?
P: Let me tell you something --
SS: I have never opted into anything and you spammed the hell out of me so don't blow smoke up my ass, alright?
P: Let... let me tell you something (unintelligible) Why do you think I (unintelligible)? Some idiot out there... they use this... kind of software that they... they find millions of crap email addresses... and I'm sure I probably have... 200 thousand (unintelligible) capital... email addresses that were all pulled by this shit software. And and... maybe you think... you're right... you're... DB (With P attempting to interrupt throughout): Well then you know what you're going to have to do, you're gonna have to tighten up your procedures... and stop using shit email addresses. Go double-opt-in, clean your lists, and only spam the people that actually want to receive your leads. And stop spamming people multiple times per day.
P: I'm willing... I'm willing to do something with you... that I wouldn't do it with anyone else. I'll even... I'll even make a special opt-out list... that I GUARRaaantee... anyone filling out this opt-out list will be removed. I guarantee this. I guarantee that this list will NEVER be used for the [good percent?] of email addresses. This list will be called the anti list of all anti lists. And if you're willing to do something with me, if the only thing that rrrreally pisses you off, Darren, is that you don't want to get emails, I *guarantee* you I can get 98% of the emails out of your inbox within two weeks. You can... Believe me --
SS: How can you guarantee that unless you're sending 98% of the spam, Alex?
P: Nooooo... This is a small business my friend. We all know each other, with partners out there... and just saying... all people... *must* remove... these email addresses from their lists. These people do not... believe me they do it, they're very small world, VERY small world... Believe me... But this is what I'm proposing to you, straightforward. And I'm happy to do it, because I don't like sending email to people who don't want to receive email. Believe me. So... Do you want to ask me to put together a list of people that absolutely do not want to receive I would make sure... every contact I have... if they want to remove this email then believe me I don't want this email.
SS: Alright and here's how you're going to start. You're going to start with every email address in the world.
P: [pause] ... This is impractical.
SS: This is what everyone wants. No one wants to receive spam, unless they've specifically opted into it.
P: Let me tell you something about opting in. You know you opt-in to website? Believe me this website you opted in to, they take your name...?
SS: I've never opted into anything.
P: Opting in is much worse...
SS: I change my email addresses every month, and you still spammed me. You did dictionary attacks against my server.
P: This is something different. This is something I was saying to you before about dictionary attacks. (unintelligible) because of these stupid dictionaries... Bullshit. We know about... waste of time, waste of effort, and it's rude! Rude! You want to send email address you send real email address. (unintelligible) [Noises in background] [Different voice in background]
P: Okay Darren I have to go... Uhhhhh... If you're not willing to put together (unintelligible) list of people who definitely don't want to receive email addresses...
SS: Well you already... you already told us that people that opt out don't uh... don't receive that so what were you disingenuous with the list that you're running right now the opt-out routine?
P: I'm sorry I didn't catch that... No, you understand if someone... someone... puts email... so say website advertising to (unintelligible) and they hit out the remove, maybe the people who are mailing to this list, they will remove the email address, but everyone else won't. What I'm suggesting to you is much different. I'm talking about a global remove list, that I can arrange... that basically I can cut away your spam by mayyybeee... mayybbeee uhhhh... 75%. Simply because, this is for me, this is the removal list that no one should email. Not in (unintelligible). You understand what I'm saying?
SS: Alright... alright... Can I call you... Can I call you Alex or is there some other name that you go by?
P: No Alex is fine...
SS: Okay... Alex you set up the website... You get a consortium of all the other large spammers in the world to get behind it... To sign off on it.
P: This is not a problem... But of course you don't start to attack this website. (unintelligible) [giggle]
SS: Right... But we want to know who will actually honor this remove.
P: This global email... Many many contacts of business this is a remove list that will be honored by many many many many (unintelligible). These people that do not want to receive ANY email whatever, and I email you already... you can go and you --
SS: Ay-ay-ay... You set... you set up the website that people can go to --
P: But I don't... Yes I will do this...
SS: Make sure that it can handle a lot of requests, because there's about, oh, 200 million people that are gonna want to opt-out.
P: Absolutely... absolutely... we will do this.
SS: Okay? And then you, uh, let me know when it's ready. But we want to know which other spammers are going to be behind this.
P: Oh believe me, this will be all the major people out there right now, all the really big guys, they will all get copies, and all get started to remove. But I ask you at the same time for you to play fair. You have to play fair. Don't start putting in email addresses for people (unintelligible).
SS: I'm not putting in any email addresses. I'm not putting in any email addresses, what are you talking about?
P: I'm saying you... If you all want to be removed, you can advertise (unintelligible) global remove list. Okay I have to go. Thank you, Darren, this morning, I'm sorry to wake you up okay?
P: Okay good bye.
Audio End: 13:06
The Register of Known Spam Operations (ROKSO) collates information and evidence on entities with a history of spamming or providing spam services, and entities affiliated or otherwise connected with them, for the purpose of assisting ISP Abuse Desks and Law Enforcement Agencies.